Lauren Langman: 0:09

Welcome to the Absolute Dog Sex in a Squirrel podcast. I'm Lauren Langman. I'm one of the world's leading dog trainers and it's my mission to help owners become their dog's top priority. In each episode, you'll discover how to gain trust and communicate with your dog like never before, creating unbreakable bonds that make you the most exciting part of their world. From nbn zero to hero, I want to introduce you to the wonderful alice and her super dog, bonnie. Alice, I know this has been a tough journey. You started at zero. You're now my hero when it comes to naughty but nice dogs advocating for them and really transformation.

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 0:45

Tell us a little bit about bonnie, where it started and how difficult it was in those early days um, yeah, we, we had sort of quite a steep learning curve, I think it's fair to say, with bonnie, especially early on. Um, we adopted her when she was two. She had been put into the rescue centre under the, frankly, mismanagement of her previous owner. There had actually been a dog fight incident which had sadly resulted in the death of the other dog. So I think Bonnie was quite lucky to actually even get the chance to go into rescue at that point, and I'm glad she did, because I think that it was a horrible situation that could have been avoided. And so it was, you know, nice for Chris and I to be able to give her that second chance that we felt she deserved.

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 1:36

But she certainly came with a lot of struggles. So, yes, you know she struggled with separation and you know that's a work in progress and it's a much better picture now than it was. But I think primarily her reactivity is the thing that we've sort of that was the most sort of shocking to us and the most sort of sort of disheartening initially to think, crikey like this is actually a lot worse than, you know, the rescue center were aware of. And, um, we've got a really steep hill to climb.

Lauren Langman: 2:09

That's kind of how it felt um, I know you described her as a grizzly bear. Like literally can imagine this grizzly bear, cross donkey at times. Now she is big, um, she's a black brindle, she. She can look quite fierce. She's a mastiff mutts, she's a crossbred mastiff breed and she's a lot of dog on a lead.

Lauren Langman: 2:30

I think it's fair to say she's a lot of dog for you because you're probably about the same weight, like both, similar sort of 50, 60, those like weights of poor past learning and poor past history. Like where you say, actually it was to the extreme that another dog died and there are so many people listening here that think, well, maybe we shouldn't have even allowed another opportunity. Well, the dog died through poor mismanagement of, actually, the scenario and the situation. She's been given an opportunity for you to rehome her. But, yes, it came with learning curve and it came with a whole host of skills you needed to learn. Did you ever feel overwhelmed in the beginning and did you ever feel, oh my God, if I bit enough more than I can chew, or are we maybe not qualified to own a dog like Bonnie?

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 3:18

We definitely did. Yeah, both Chris and I, there was a period of time where we really did kind of feel like, can we do this, can we make this work? We really were quite determined because we thought, okay, she's a massive problem, but she's our massive problem now of find solutions, and so that's kind of where we poured our energy into. But it certainly wasn't easy and there definitely was times when we kind of felt like, you know, is this beyond our capabilities? Um, but, but as a team, so we, we have kind of managed to build a very different picture now, um, one from where, you know, because of bonnie's strength and her the sort of the degree of her reactivity early on, um, you know, chris was really the only one who could actually handle that lead safely at times, because she did pull me over, you know, she did kind of drag me across the field a couple of times, and we thought, okay, let's not have that become a pattern.

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 4:16

Let's, let's just, let's build those skills, let's kind of build that relationship, let's try and kind of like see, you know, let's, let's train so that, um, that we can, you know, create a happier, healthier bonnie where we can have a sort of a calmer, you know, nicer walks, but in, but you know, whilst we were bridging that gap, then you know sort of um, chris's stature was essential in terms of us kind of having any kind of um. You know, um, not just kind of and it's not like going for walks when she wasn't ready, because we kind of we ditched that and we rewound and we kind of did a lot of kind of homeschooling with bonnie, but it was more when we were ready to start risking forward, when we were start ready to start kind of bridging that gap. Um, it just sort of made us feel a lot safer when we were working as a team than it wouldn't and if I had been on my own with Bonnie, for sure.

Lauren Langman: 5:05

Now Bonnie's transformation has been huge, from the point, I suppose, when I first met her and I thought, dear Lord, I wouldn't want to meet this dog on a walk to oh my goodness, I would gleefully meet these guys on a walk. In fact I'd actually go out for walks with you with a dog like Mango or maybe even dog like Brave. With a dog like Mango or maybe even dog like Brave, who I know they are very, very savvy and they're very, very dog cool. But also I know they're a little bit bigger and I feel that they would be quite appropriate and they'd be able to behave appropriately with Bonnie and I do feel she'd be able to behave appropriate with them too.

Lauren Langman: 5:34

Now for those people listening thinking, oh my goodness, how has this transformation happened? And I just don't believe that this is possible. Give us just some of the steps in that transformation, because you really did start at zero. You had a naughty but nice dog, seriously leash, aggressive, has history of hurting another dog and actually killing another dog and, equally, you've got her as your dog. She's now your rehome. She's not a rescue, she's your dog. How have we taken it from dog that you wouldn't want to meet out at all to actually dog, who we'd happily go out for a walk with, because that is one mega transformation, even more so in a mastiff style mutt, I feel, because of the breed dispositions and tendencies. If we're looking at what they're bred to do, there is a level of fight in them and there is a level of like, feisty and guard breed, and so I think we need to be a bit mindful of that too. But but how did that transformation happen?

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 6:29

like what? What are the key sort of moments that you feel? Yet that was pivotal. Yeah, because it, because it sounds bonkers, doesn't it? And I think, actually, if I could take a moment to sort of speak directly to anyone listening to this, who may be, you may have been told that there's no hope, with the first trainer that we spoke to said bonnie will never like other dogs, you know. And, um, we had, luckily, I'd kind of booked appointments with a number of different local trainers and stuff and I'm like, okay, well, we don't really like that outcome, but we'll just see what anyone else has to say.

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 6:55

And we did find someone who talked through games, who absolutely was a lot more optimistic and gave us hope that we weren't, we weren't, fighting a lost battle. But if you're, if you're sitting and you're listening to this and you've maybe been told that you know there's no hope for your dog, or you're feeling like you're at the bottom of a very steep mountain, thinking how on earth am I going to scale this massive problem? There is a manageable route up that mountain. You just need someone to guide you in the right way. You just need the right guidance and the right route, the right step by step, because what we did to kind of break down this sort of mammoth task was um, um, well, I mean ditching the walks, ditching the walks and ditching the bowl, kind of first steps. Page one um, for us it was kind of by default because Bonnie had some orthopaedic struggles as well. So we were on vet instructions to ditch the walks for a while whilst she waited for and then had various procedures that she needed.

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 7:53

But whilst we were in that period it was actually the best thing for her, both physically and in terms of her behavioural work on the concepts she needed that she was lacking, sort of most profoundly armless disengagement and optimism. Work on games that built those skills in a safe, controlled environment without the kind of distractions that were that we had seen from. You know, having these massive public meltdowns were just too much for her. She just simply did not have the skills that you know a lot of other dog owners which kind of just take for granted that their dog would be cool with, so by just shrinking down her world temporarily to work on those skills in a kind of homeschooling kind of environment and then, when she was physically ready as well, to start gradually bridging that gap by. You know, for example, maybe we'd been playing magic hand at home and encouraging that close proximity, that focus on the handler. Well then I could start playing magic hand at, maybe, a private, higher secure field.

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 9:06

So we're outdoors, it's a field environment, but there's still nothing else really unpredictable that's going to be happening. But can she focus on me instead of, maybe, the smells in the grass? Then maybe we go to a different field where maybe, or at a time when we know it's going to be quiet, where it's a huge amount of space, maybe there'll be another dog walker at the other end of the field and gradually and gradually and gradually, as we can see, can she demonstrate that her brain's in her head right now? Can she engage with us? Can she start to behave in a calmer manner? You know, can she disengage from things that maybe she couldn't before? Starting with kind of easy things like, say, a smell in the grass was never going to get a full Baskerville response from Bonnie, but it's still a distraction, whereas a dog running after a ball in the field would have gotten a big sort of Baskerville meltdown.

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 10:00

And so you kind of just you got to look at the distractions in terms of how your dog used to respond to them and just start with those easier wins and gradually build your way up and um. And also I think it's important to remember that progress isn't linear, that you know your line is going to go in the right direction if you're playing the games and you're putting in, you know the effort and you kind of you're playing the right menu of games for what concepts your dog needs. But you're gonna have good days and bad days, just like we all do. So it's kind of um, it's that's. That's a really powerful thing to remember. Again, if you're listening to this and you're thinking I don't know where to begin, or you've had a really horrible day, you're just in tears because your dog's done something utterly awful that you didn't see coming. Like, that's OK, it's a bad day, but like, dust yourself off and know that actually you know tomorrow could be better and you're heading in the right direction if you're playing the right games.

Lauren Langman: 10:57

Now, I know that it also. It really isn't linear On the days where it's not linear, how have you picked yourself up?

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 11:06

grab some easy wins, so kind of don't, don't.

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 11:10

If you just and you start to get a sense for it, you start to kind of if you've got the right games and you can take a bit of a pulse check with where your dog's brain is at, you can soon tell if they're in the right frame of mind and they're in the right sort of headspace to risk forward and push your training on a little bit.

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 11:24

Or maybe they're not and maybe you just wind it back, you do something a bit easier so that you're still setting your dog up for success, but you're maybe just not giving them the biggest challenge that day if they're not showing you that they're quite there for it. My other top tip is to have something that's just for you. Have something that empties your bucket, because having something that you can enjoy that's nothing to do with work and that's nothing to do with dog training that you make time for in your weekly schedule or a daily schedule, something that is your moment to empty your bucket, is hugely important in being able to then be the best advocate for your dog. You know, being in the best headspace yourself, um is is really, really not to be um pushed aside when you say that, alice, I'm there going.

Lauren Langman: 12:15

Gosh, that's actually really hard, because most of mine do at some point involve a dog or, um, an animal at least, but normally a dog. So I'm thinking I would go for a walk, but actually you're right. So go on, give us a couple of examples of some of yours. Oh, a couple of mine.

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 12:29

Okay, so, okay. So I'm a massive nerd, lauren. So one of mine is so like every morning or a couple of times a day, I'm on Duolingo, learning and teaching myself Norwegian. So I'm just there with my cup of tea and I'm practicing on Duolingo and it's just my little zone and absolutely nothing else is getting involved whatsoever. So that's kind of one of mine, and and absolutely nothing else is getting involved whatsoever. So that's kind of one of mine. And then another one is, um, usually on about maybe like a weekly basis something.

Lauren Langman: 12:58

Me and some of my buddies, we we all sort of team up and we play some dungeons and dragons.

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 12:59

So it's just something completely different, totally worlds away from anything that's work related or dog training related. That is just your, your space. Whatever I'm about to be a yoga class, it might be going swimming, it might whatever you enjoy, yes just yeah, I do yoga and I watch my chickens.

Lauren Langman: 13:14

So I definitely do yoga and pilates and I watch the chickens out the window. And I do have an instructor and she often says to me and lauren, I'm in the room, ignore the chickens. And I'm like just chickened out like I was then, out with my chickens. That's a really nice one. So so, alice, zero to hero. You really are my naughty but nice hero For anyone listening. Is it doable, is it achievable?

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 13:34

It is.

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 13:35

It completely is Like I say, bonnie, you know, was potentially heading towards a kind of a go to sleep situation.

Pro Dog Trainer, Alice & Bonnie's Owner: 13:42

You know, with her history and with the struggles she kind of she had, and she's so much more. She's a much happier, healthier dog now. We have a much better relationship, a much better home life with her now than we did when we got her sort of was it three years ago now and you know we're able to do so much more with her, so much more than we ever could have imagined, you know. And that is all through games. So if you're listening to this, if you can jump into games, do it, because then you've got hundreds of games to choose from and you've got so much choice and the support of the community, which actually is vital, I think, when you're struggling with a kind of quite extreme sort of NBN case. But even if you can just get a couple of the 10 days to stop reactivity or whatever particular 10 days course best fits your, your NBN situation like it gets you on the right track and it kind of gives you those little bite sized pieces of health that just start paving the way to success.

Lauren Langman: 14:42

So you heard it here first. This is Alice's journey from zero to naughty but nice hero. Take that leap. I know you can do it, we know you can do it and Alice certainly knows you can do it. Now it's up to you to do it.