SPEAKER_00: 0:37

Welcome to the Absolute Dogs Text in a Squirrel podcast. I'm Lauren Langman. I'm one of the world's leading dog trainers, and it's my mission to help owners become their dog's top priority. In each episode, you'll discover how to gain trust and communicate with your dog like never before, creating unbreakable bonds that make you the most exciting part of their world. Responsibility. It sounds serious. And yes, it is serious. The stakes are high. Our next dog, she actually killed a dog, and I know people are listening thinking, oh my goodness. Bonnie killed a dog before Alice owned her. And responsibility, the stakes really can be high. Now, when we're talking about our responsibility as our dog's owners, advocates, guardians, pet parents, whatever we want to name ourselves, Alice, I think so many owners don't realise quite how responsible we need to be. And I believe that Bonnie, in your hands, would never have had that, been in that situation in the first place to be close proximity with to another dog where they fought and that resulted in the other dog losing their life. Ultimately, though, so many dogs are in those positions, and so many owners are not advocating for their dogs or are not responsible enough for them. What do you think?

SPEAKER_01: 1:50

Completely. I think that we we know very little about the situation that happened before Bonnie was rehomed, but certainly there was too much responsibility being put on the dogs in that situation, uh, and certainly not enough responsibility being taken by the humans. But when, you know, we we when we rehomed Bonnie, when we adopted Bonnie, and we knew the history she'd come with, we knew that we had a big responsibility to actually make sure that life was turned around, to make sure that her behaviour was turned around, and to make sure that we were being responsible owners, not just in how we advocated for her, but how we actually do our duty in terms of like dog owners in the UK and the law in terms of dog ownership and with having the safe responsibility for your dog and knowing that actually with Bonnie's history, we did need to be careful because you know, we need to be able to make sure we have safe control of our pets here in the UK, and whether that means on-lead or off-lead doesn't matter. And actually, they only need to scare someone really for it to be potentially reported and it to be a problem. So, you know, Bonnie certainly demonstrated some scary behaviours early on, and that was definitely something that we were determined wasn't just going to be the be-all and end all for her, that that wasn't just set in stone, and that there was, you know, we could train that and we could we could work on that in a kind way to to kind of help her be a healthier, happier dog and and to not be a menace to society.

SPEAKER_00: 3:25

Now, one thing you said there, I mean, you mentioned a couple of things. One is the Dangerous Dogs Act in the UK. Uh, that act really does say if your dog scares someone, then they potentially are reportable. And Bonnie just being um large black brindle, mastiff mutt, as you would call her, um, crossbred, grizzly bear, donkey, like you know what, she's a big dog. And that for me sort of rung true that, yeah, the law is the law is not on the side of the dog. And the second one that you said, and I think this really resonates as true, is actually you had a big responsibility, and you have a big responsibility, and the stakes are high. What do you mean by that, Alice? Because the stakes really are high, and I truly believe that. And also, I feel like you're in a really good place with Bonnie now, and so I feel it's a very different space to what you were in. And at the same time, yeah, the stakes are high.

SPEAKER_01: 4:10

Definitely. So, I mean, if if we look at an example of, you know, a dog that struggles with maybe being pessimistic and over aroused by seeing another dog in its environment, you know, a common problem that a lot of listeners are going to be able to relate to, or maybe there's a struggle that they too have been able to turn around and overcome. But if we look at that behaviour being displayed by, you know, like a, you know, a small dog, a sort of West Highland terrier or something like that, how many people, I mean, obviously people do have phobias of dogs, but like how many people in general are going to find themselves feeling genuinely scared or threatened by that behavior being displayed by a West Highland terrier? And then you get a sort of giant breech mix, brindle, you know, practically human-sized, that is displaying the same emotional response to the same distraction, the same sort of um uh novelty in the environment. And that behavior comes across very differently, much bigger, much louder, much scarier. So, you know, the chances of you know, Bonnie causing a problem or causing fear to somebody, you know, in the environment was obviously kind of much higher with her history, much higher chance of her not getting another chance. It could have been potentially a put-to-sleep situation had we been reported for anything. And of course, legal implications for Chris and I potentially. So it's something we do take really seriously and always have. And even though Bonnie's in a much, much healthier, happier space now, her behavior is is vastly different from where we started with her. So the games do work. Anyone listening who's maybe listening for the first time and is not quite sure about this newfangled games-based training malaki, like let this be evidence that actually miracles can happen. So even though that, you know, she's a totally different dog, you could say, now, we're still very sort of cautious of that. We're still very cautious that, you know, she could frighten someone just by, you know, being excited or something, or, you know, that, you know, we're not just gonna let her off lead playing with any types of dogs. We're gonna be quite selective about the dogs that we introduce her to because she is capable of making dog friends now. And, you know, that that is something that we're gonna be selective about and careful about and and appropriate about, and kind of we are gonna keep an eye on the amount of sort of high arousal play we allow, you know, her to do and in what environment, just to sort of make sure that we'd never, we would never be in that position where we were mismanaging her.

SPEAKER_00: 6:44

Now, just to think on a little bit of tips tennis here on responsibility and and giving examples of places where you could consider your responsibility for your dog. And I feel like we could just juggle a few and back and forth. My first one would be when your dog is off lead. I feel that it is your responsibility always as an owner to have full control over that dog. And so when you see another dog in the distance, my take on it is that I don't want my dog to take off and run off to another dog, but I also don't want another dog to take off and run into my dogs. It's your responsibility, owners, it's your responsibility, listeners, it's your responsibility to have a great recall, to have a dog with great proximity. You can get all of that in the games club, you can get total recall and some of our ultra real, like they we we sort of drill down on the skills. Total recall is a my one of my favorites. But most of all, you as an owner, understanding that and understanding that just because he's friendly doesn't mean that he should have a free-for-all with every dog in the park. So that's my first one. How about you, Alice? Some areas owners could take responsibility for their dogs.

SPEAKER_01: 7:50

Train a muzzle, like train your dog to be comfortable and happy wearing a muzzle. Because, you know, whether that is because you are sort of gradually growing their world and you're gradually working through reactivity, you know, issues. And like you say, you can you can only control so much in the environment. You know, you know, you can keep your dog on lead, you can play, be playing the games, but if another dog kind of runs in from nowhere, you want to know that actually you're still doing everything you can to manage that situation safely, where you can get your dog moving away, you can make space, you can calmly make distance and remove yourself from any unwanted excitement and visitors, and you can do that in the safest way possible. So I think actually training a muzzle, whether it's it's for that reason, whether it's for vet safety, whether it's for travel, whatever the reason might be, like I think training that as a fun game before you ever actually need it, that would be one of my top tips.

SPEAKER_00: 8:46

So my next one, responsibility-wise, and I love that one, and it follows on quite nicely, is it's your responsibility at the vets to make sure that you safeguard both your dog and your vet and all of the waiting room. So for me, the muzzle might be appropriate, leaving your dog in the car might be appropriate, bringing your dog in only when it's appropriate is appropriate. And for me, taking video of your dog beforehand, all of these things that you can prep and do in advance of your dog is your responsibility at the vets. No, they shouldn't be lunging, barking, grabbing. Uh it doesn't matter if it's a stressful space, you know what, leave them in the vehicle if you need to, leave someone sitting in the vehicle if you need to, tell the vet that you've arrived and stay in the vehicle with your dog. But there are so many opportunities for you to be more responsible for your dog and for you to effectively advocate for your dog better and take on that responsibility so that they don't have to. For me, that's really important. How about another one of yours, Alice, where responsibility when you're out and about with maybe Bonnie or when you're in the house with with Bonnie, what responsibility is yours?

SPEAKER_01: 9:45

Oh, yeah. So I say that uh off lead isn't everything, you know, and there's and there's and there's a kind of a gradient as well. I think, I think maybe we feel as dog owners like we like we have a responsibility to give our dogs off-lead fees and like we need to give them that opportunity. Actually, not if we're gonna set them up to fail. It, you know, that's it's not a good idea, but it's also it doesn't have to be all or nothing. You don't have to think, oh, well, you know, you're keeping your dog on a short lead up until the point that you unclip them, and then it's just kind of a bit of a free-for-all. There's so many clever ways of either total recall is so good. I I I did that badge recently, and it's just oh, the levels and the get the the choices of games, they're so good. And and the actually in the range of dogs that are in that course as well, you see like students working with a whole host of different breeds, which is just demonstrates how vastly applicable this training is. But where was I? Yes, I got excited about total retall. Yeah, on and off lead. So actually making it a non-event, not not giving yourself loads of pressure to think, oh, when do I unclip? Is this the moment? Is this the moment we've all been waiting for? Okay, maybe clip on, clip off, clip onto a long line, you know, it can change from day to day. Actually, that that that branching out into off-lead freedom does not need to be a high pressure moment. Actually, it really shouldn't be. If it feels high pressure, it's not time to do it. But actually, doing some games where you can kind of see where your dog's headspace is at, are they ready for some of that freedom? Just taking it gradually. And that might also be in the house, as you said. You know, you might be using puppy lines or, you know, an indoor line if your struggle is around visitors or something like that. So awfully doesn't need to be a given.

SPEAKER_00: 11:32

I love that. No, I think really, really nice one. Another one for me, taking responsibility, it might even be in your house and with your household manners. For me, owning uh multiple dogs and having a daughter and having a partner and having visitors and having guests, then my responsibility. The guests are um potentially needed to be stationary before I let my dogs into the same room, securing food, for example, uh countersurfers, making sure you haven't put food on the edge. That's not your dog's responsibility to not take it as your responsibility to set them up correctly at first, especially if they've had any prior history in doing things that you're potentially trying to grow them out of. Uh so for me, that again is your responsibility. Move things, set them up for success. Another great example for me is counters and sofas and furniture generally. If you don't want your dog in those spaces, well, what responsibility can you take to try and help set them up so they don't do it? Whether that's pens, gates, crates, stair gates, you know what, there are so many different opportunities to give your dogs the right information, but don't maybe leave it out in front of them, expecting them not to take it. It's kind of like dangling a sort of carrot above it sometimes. So I think that we can take more responsibility there. Maybe in the household, popping a long line or a puppy line rather on your dog. So you've got a puppy line to be able to pick them back up again. And that can be an adult dog who's picked up a bad habit. Sometimes take the responsibility, sometimes take that opportunity to go. No, actually, he probably doesn't know better because there's that saying, oh, he knows better. No, he doesn't know better, he just knows you get in a bad mood every time it happens. He actually possibly doesn't know what triggered those reactions or what triggered that chain of behavior. Actually, this dog is a dog who's out for himself normally and out to find all the things, whether it's the chicken on the counter. And I've got a great story here. Matt was cooking, I think we're doing steak. Anyway, he had these steaks lined up, ready to go, and he turned his back and then he turned around again, and one of the steaks was gone. None of the dogs had moved, not one of the dogs had inch, like nothing at all, like they hadn't moved at all, and yet a steak was gone. So, when is it your responsibility to effectively acknowledge that they don't have this skill right now? He didn't have four dogs that could hold on their beds, obviously, because one of them had removed themselves, taken the stake, and gone back again. And there wasn't even a lick lip or anything. He couldn't work out who had done it. He turned for all of 20 seconds, like we're talking tiny, tiny moments. So for me, take responsibility in the home too. Take responsibility for what your dog doesn't know whilst growing the skills so that they do know in the future. Definitely. And go on, Alice. Do you have any final responsibility moments where you think, no, I really have had to be responsible for Bonnie there because Bonnie hasn't necessarily had the right upbringing or information or skill to be able to handle that situation?

SPEAKER_01: 14:16

Yeah, absolutely. And it's another household one that I thought of when you were talking about that. Was that sort of doorways actually is a is a kind of important one. Whether that's doorways kind of an in-between spaces in the house, and like if you've got a multi-dog household, have they got responsibility to be in the same space together, or do they need to be, you know, in separate areas or on separate boundaries? That's kind of one thought. But for us in our house, so our living room, the front door just kind of is if you've got the living room and the pavement, there's just one door between. So, you know, if we get a delivery or something, that's not a space Bonnie needs to be in. As a dog who's naturally wary of strangers, especially coming into her space, that she doesn't need to be there. She doesn't have the responsibility to be involved in that situation. There's absolutely, she's not going to sign for a delivery, she doesn't need to be there. So, you know, gaming games like like uh ding dong dash has been brilliant for us because it means door goes, doorbell goes, she knows, goes to the kitchen. So she can be in just a separate room whilst we deal with whoever's at the door and she is safely out of the way. She's not being a menace to the postman and you know, she's safe. Everybody's, you know, got the right management and responsibility that's appropriate for that situation.

SPEAKER_00: 15:27

Absolutely gorgeous example. I loved that example, Alice. Now, I know that listeners, all of you guys, you're thinking, maybe I've not been quite responsible enough, or maybe I could be more responsible, or maybe I'm too responsible and not actually getting them to level up because there is a time that you want them to level up too. If you're listening, you are in the right place. You're in the home of the best dog training in the world. It's absolute dogs. And I absolutely want all of you to share this message. Make sure you give it to a friend, make sure you give it to a sister, a brother, a long-lost lover. Definitely, definitely make sure this message gets out there so that we can encourage this ripple effect to go even further. We'll see you next week. And I cannot wait for another episode of the Sex and Scrolls podcast.